On Apr. 14, http://www.libyafeb17.com/ published a post titled Video: State TV claims to show Gaddafi touring Tripoli this afternoon. A "green" Libyan (i.e. a Qaddafi supporter) joined the discussion to put his twopence. Here is a quote from his comments:
"KADDAFI IS A REAL LEADER! AND SIMPLE PEOPLE LOVE HIM! MILLIONS OF LIBYANS LIKE HIM!... I know that Kaddafi makes a lot of mistakes! Specially last years when his son Saif al Islam brought to him the list of reforms he was planning to make but Kaddafi canceled all of them! Also it was no free press. But you have to understand that he is a man of ideology and he was opposing USA! The most powerful country of the world..."
My own comments in that discussion aren't worth a copy-paste, because this guy pushed up my blood pressure and I called him names. This is not a good thing to do in any discussion, though he deserved it well. However, another commenter with the simple nick "a" (the same one who visited my previous post) made better contributions. I am giving a part of them below, advising all my readers - and especially the "green" Libyans - to have a look.
"You know what? I am from Germany. I know this kind of stupid babble from some of our delusional grandfathers, -mothers... In Gaddafi, we only recognize a very poor Mini-Hitler... The “simple people” you speak of, he just betrays them. They are human material for him, he will not shed one tear if you die... It's your own decision: Be part of a past that is despised, attach yourself to a murderer without honor. End up in history's dustbin together with him. Or be part of the future of Libya.
Gaddafi... claims he made a revolution in Libya, and brought direct democracy, and spread the wealth of the oil money. Sounds good. But it is not the truth:
What kind of revolution is this, where only one family rules for 40 years and every opposition voice is silenced? It's like a monarchy. What kind of “direct democracy” is this, where citizens cannot even express their demand that after 40 years they want another government?
Why is no free press and no critizism allowed? If Gaddafi's ideas were so good, he needn't be afraid of competition with other ideas.
What happened to all the money, where is it, why do the Gaddafis own billions and spend Libya's money as they please?
What kind of real revolutionary would buy mercenaries and have them shoot at his own people? Even Mubarak stepped aside, Ben Ali quickly took an airplane. Gaddafi chose to kill people who do not agree to him. This is unacceptable, no matter what ideology he claims behind this.
And I am sick of people putting ideology or religion over human lives and the self-determination of others. Saif had the chance of reforming things, he was weak and lazy, and chose to have lavish parties in Europe instead. He had his chance, now it's Game Over.
But. At least you try to argue, and I try to understand you. That's a good start, isn't it? Instead of hatred. You have already risen above your dictator by doing that.
If you think there is anything good in Gaddafi's ideas, you will always be able to stand up for such ideas and raise awareness for them in a real democracy. Found a party that supports direct democracy and spreading Libya's natural wealth – I have no problem with that. But stop supporting a dictator who will impose only his own ideas over 6 million people and kill anyone who does not agree. Can’t you see that this is fundamentally wrong?"
"KADDAFI IS A REAL LEADER! AND SIMPLE PEOPLE LOVE HIM! MILLIONS OF LIBYANS LIKE HIM!... I know that Kaddafi makes a lot of mistakes! Specially last years when his son Saif al Islam brought to him the list of reforms he was planning to make but Kaddafi canceled all of them! Also it was no free press. But you have to understand that he is a man of ideology and he was opposing USA! The most powerful country of the world..."
My own comments in that discussion aren't worth a copy-paste, because this guy pushed up my blood pressure and I called him names. This is not a good thing to do in any discussion, though he deserved it well. However, another commenter with the simple nick "a" (the same one who visited my previous post) made better contributions. I am giving a part of them below, advising all my readers - and especially the "green" Libyans - to have a look.
"You know what? I am from Germany. I know this kind of stupid babble from some of our delusional grandfathers, -mothers... In Gaddafi, we only recognize a very poor Mini-Hitler... The “simple people” you speak of, he just betrays them. They are human material for him, he will not shed one tear if you die... It's your own decision: Be part of a past that is despised, attach yourself to a murderer without honor. End up in history's dustbin together with him. Or be part of the future of Libya.
Gaddafi... claims he made a revolution in Libya, and brought direct democracy, and spread the wealth of the oil money. Sounds good. But it is not the truth:
What kind of revolution is this, where only one family rules for 40 years and every opposition voice is silenced? It's like a monarchy. What kind of “direct democracy” is this, where citizens cannot even express their demand that after 40 years they want another government?
Why is no free press and no critizism allowed? If Gaddafi's ideas were so good, he needn't be afraid of competition with other ideas.
What happened to all the money, where is it, why do the Gaddafis own billions and spend Libya's money as they please?
What kind of real revolutionary would buy mercenaries and have them shoot at his own people? Even Mubarak stepped aside, Ben Ali quickly took an airplane. Gaddafi chose to kill people who do not agree to him. This is unacceptable, no matter what ideology he claims behind this.
And I am sick of people putting ideology or religion over human lives and the self-determination of others. Saif had the chance of reforming things, he was weak and lazy, and chose to have lavish parties in Europe instead. He had his chance, now it's Game Over.
But. At least you try to argue, and I try to understand you. That's a good start, isn't it? Instead of hatred. You have already risen above your dictator by doing that.
If you think there is anything good in Gaddafi's ideas, you will always be able to stand up for such ideas and raise awareness for them in a real democracy. Found a party that supports direct democracy and spreading Libya's natural wealth – I have no problem with that. But stop supporting a dictator who will impose only his own ideas over 6 million people and kill anyone who does not agree. Can’t you see that this is fundamentally wrong?"
2 comments:
Dear Maya, I agree, nice and profound article.
Can you see the lives which are taken in the name of democracy and as for oil, gold..........
can you truly feel the atrocities...
Here is an:
article provides the most detailed assessment so far of civilian deaths in the name of democracy by some perpetrators.
http://bdclaymart.blogspot.com/2011/06/entanglement-of-humanity-for-oil-gold_11.html
Oh, I just saw that repost of my comment right now!
Though it did not change patriots view anyhow, I'm afraid. Feeling still honored, a
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